Two questions to ask pastors:
1) Why is it that in wedding sermons these days almost no mention is made of marriage and that the wedding sermon is a naked attempt to sneak in an evangelistic talk to the pagan relatives? Isn't this almost entirely counterproduction AND an opportunity to reflect on scripture's teaching about marriage lost? And why does such a sermon have to go for 20+ minutes - it's a wedding for heaven's sake!
2) Why, on the one day of the year that non-church goers venture into a church building, that day when they come in the (it turns out) vain hope that they might get to sing some Christmas carols, do we insist on singing as few Christmas carols as possible? What the?
18 comments:
Michael,
Clearly you need to come to www.stmarks.com.au at Penannt Hills for Christmas; guaranteed 'carols only'.
On weddings, I agree that many talks are waaay too long. I aim for 7 minutes which allows me to hit the highlights of Ephesians 5 and talk about marriage and the gospel; you just need to get the couple to decide that's the passage to have read at their wedding. I'm discovering many young Christian couples choose it for themselves.
I also find that often the pressure to 'give the relative the gospel with both barrels' comes from the couple themselves who see no other opportunity to get their families to church
...yes, in which case, the pastor should resist! Marriage is itself a vision of the gospel. Talk about that! Anyhow - I am yet to hear of anyone's relatives who were somehow convinced in the context of a wedding service.
'Yes' to both points, Michael ... but for the record I came to Jesus in the wake of my brother's wedding, which I recall featured quite a strong gospel talk :)
As long as we sing good carols, I'm all for lots of them! We sang 5 at City Night Church last night :)
1. It strikes me that it is very hard to unpack what the Bible says about marriage without at the same time explaining the love of God in Christ very clearly.
I think unbelieving visitors know when they are being targeted and it easily comes across as duplicitous.
The one thing they are all interested is the couple, so ministering to the bride and groom in a personal way is far more likely to have all the others on the edge of their seats.
2. Agreed. And carols are the time to go for a trad service: organ, choir, candles, etc.
Weddings are often a time for families and old friends of the couple to catch up - sometimes haven't not seen each other for a few years, and for friends of relative or relatives to find out about the spouse who they may hardly know.
Isn't the importance of Jesus to the couple something that is appropriate to convey, as it must be as important for getting to know them as their hobbies, history, or how they met, which often appear in speeches?
Or maybe you'd argue the speeches are a better context for the gospel?
Nick (getting married in 4.5 months, God willing)
Nick said: "Isn't the importance of Jesus to the couple something that is appropriate to convey ..."
Come now. This can be done rather quickly. The post is directed against attempts to use the captivity of the audience at the wedding to pursue another agenda. Do you want to claim that you have never been to such a wedding? I've been to several.
When I was at College, no less a figure than John Chapman urged strongly that occasional addresses should (a) be brief, and (b) respect the legitimate expectations and interests of the occasional congregation. It is a brave man who would aim to be more hard-core than JC on evangelistic matters.
We had ten carols last Sunday night. Feel free to come visit next year.
Josh- that was your one day of the year? I had the feeling Michael might have been referring to Christmas! ;-)
But re 1) - surely, Michael, the issue is not with wedding sermons, but wedding readings? After all, it's hard to avoid speaking about marriage when preaching on Ephesians 5, and it's pretty tough to work it in if your passage is 2 Corinthians 5:21.
But this and the question of length I think comes down to perception: is it a wedding ceremony, or a church service that includes a wedding? I think we might be gun-shy here. I had some non-Christian friends visit church for the first time last weekend, and although I am not yet a completely perfect preacher (let the reader understand), and I was preaching on the last five chapters of 1 Samuel at the end of a long series, so they were missing all the context and hadn't even read the chapters in question, they stayed with me the whole time. The comment afterwards was that it was nothing like they expected a sermon to be - because I was speaking in normal English, rather than droning on reading various authorities.
That is, to be brief, I think there might be some strength in giving a well-crafted, standard length sermon (no bait and switch), because it confounds expectations in a helpful way.
As for 2), having just observed a large crowd at a carols event sit and watch a band play and sing, without making any effort to sing themselves, I'm starting to wonder whether 'carols attendance' isn't a get-out-of-church-free card - I've done my religious bit, so I can enjoy the rest of Christmas with a clear conscience. In the same way, perhaps, I can go to church, sing the carols on autopilot, and tune out for the rest of the service. Or am I too Grinchy here?
Agree to both points...
We had Eccl 5:1-7 at our wedding, and Shane preached on the importance of keeping vows made before God. It was good for us to hear, and rattled a few rellies to boot. There was plenty of other points during the service where our commitment to Christ was made clear.
As a third question, I also want to ask why most of our churches 'go on holidays' straight after Christmas.
It seems like a lost opportunity to connect with those who come to a Christmas service, find it not as bad as they thought and decide to come again in the New Year (while they're on holidays and have the time).
They turn up to a half-deserted church with no kids program and most of the staff away. Hardly a missional mindset.
Great post! It reminds me of a comment that Phil Jensen once made: from his best estimate, he reckons more people have become Christians after hearing his 'love, sex, marriage' talks than his 'evangelistic' talks. Perhaps if we just preached biblical marriage, we would get the result that most people hope for by insisting their relatives sit through two ways to live.
@Anthony - You're right, I misread. Though I doubt whether the visitors we had for our two carols services last Sunday will come again this Christmas Day. (just picked up the runsheet for Christmas Day and it has five carols)
May I add one more 'let it be' question?
The next time your you pastor says 'church is not like a social club', ask him what he is doing to make it more like one!
When evangelicals do this is anyone else reminded of the Fast Show? Here's an example http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LH-yg1ABv0E but there are plenty of other sketches they did on this theme.
Since marriage is based on God's love for us in Jesus - it seems perfectly appropriate to make a wedding talk outrageously evangelistic. How can you preach properly on marriage and ignore God's love for us in Jesus?
Also - why set it up as a false dichotomy? Why can't you be outrageously evangelistic yet at the same time preach short, and appropriately for the situation, respecting the "captive" audience (who are there voluntarily)? I don't see how these things are necessarily in conflict.
Of course - if it's done badly at your church, perhaps the call should be to do it well, rather then not at all
You are becoming increasingly sound, young Michael. When are you coming back home?
With regards to Anthony's comment about Christmas carols: In my view the best Christmas carols contain the best theology, and are universally loved and expected at Christmas. Those only attend church at Christmas, I believe tend to enjoy them. In terms of large carol events, I attended one, and yes, most people weren't singing along. I also went to St Andrew's cathedral, and most people were singing along because they had come to church, rather than just a carols event.
The thing with traditional carols at Christmas, is that people remember them because they are sung every year. Surely this combined with the theology contained within affords a great opportunity for the preacher to tell people what they are actually singing about. I mean, think of the glorious 'Hark the Herald Angels Sing', or 'Joy to the world' just to name 2.
After that, you pray that the Holy Spirit takes the truth of those words long sung and buried deep in the memory and fires cold hearts.
Doing a wedding sermon badly:
"We're here today for Jill and Jack. To understand them, you need to understand what they believe. So let me tell you about Jesus."
Of course, it can be done well, so that the congregation are genuinely asking the question that the radical promises of love address.
Carols - of course, a no brainer. The more the merrier (as long as they are actually good). A high quality nine lessons and carols (without sermon) can be one of the most powerful evangelistic experiences in the calender.
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